You know what Honda needs?

"BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather" (bugeyedacura)
05/20/2014 at 20:37 • Filed to: None

A direct injected K20 based I5 and I6. The smaller one (250hp) goes into the S2k replacement, and the larger one (300hp) is used to make an Acura GT car to compete with cars like the BMW Z and MB SLK.

DISCUSSION (21)

Tom McParland > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 20:38

I dunno about an I5 when Honda's 4cyl motors are so good....but I6 is brilliant

Racescort666 > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 20:41

Normally I believe that manufacturers should stick to their competency but this just seems like the kind of horribly awesome idea that could be excellent in execution.

Axial > Racescort666
05/20/2014 at 20:43

Honda certainly knows how to make a better driving car than BMW, seeing as they've done it before. They just need to inject some crazy back into the boardroom, because current management has gotten too comfortable playing the beige game.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Racescort666
05/20/2014 at 20:47

Inline in their core competency. Last I checked, the S2k is universally loved, and a GT version probably would be too.

Racescort666 > Axial
05/20/2014 at 20:49

Well said. That's what I was alluding to with regard to "excellent in execution." Honda could absolutely make something totally badass. They made an I6 motorcycle engine way back in the day but they don't have a long history of I6s. However, they are good enough with engine development that they could totally doit if they tried.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Tom McParland
05/20/2014 at 20:53

I think the I5 would be important since 200 is apparently no longer a bechmark, and to get a K20 or K24 up to 250 would require a pretty high redline. A 2.5 DI I5 based off the K20 would produce 250hp at a livable 7000rpms and a matching 175 ftlb of torque.

theloudmouth > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 20:54

Well considering they're only NOW debuting a true DI performance engine, I would not hold my breath.... But it would be awesome.

Axial > Racescort666
05/20/2014 at 20:55

Not even just engines, they are good at chassis tuning and all the other stuff that goes into a great car. The S2000 was better than the Z3 in just about every way. The Civic Si is better than the GTI, etc. Hond a is very, very good, and it just makes me more disappointed every time they announce a new car and it turns out to be either an eco-mobile or an economy-mobile. They can do so much more.

I really want to see them put out a RWD 330i competitor. I bet it would blow the German offering away.

Tom McParland > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 20:55

Yeah but the S2000 had 240hp at what like 8k RPM...that is what made it awesome...it was a crotch-rocket with doors. I have faith that Honda can tune a 2.4L to 250hp and keep it driveable.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Tom McParland
05/20/2014 at 21:01

The AP1 had a 9k redline. It was dropped to 8400 for the AP2. And I agree. But then everyone complains. Otherwise the new Si wouldn't have the K24 in it.

Tom McParland > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 21:04

My issue with the K24 in the Si is for me it is "under-engineered" by Honda standards. They could do better, but they won't. You can't tell me Honda can't make that a reliable 225 hp motor all day. Would we lose some torque and have to up the revs...sure, but if they are not going to turbo at least have the hp numbers on paper be on par with the other hot hatches.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > Tom McParland
05/20/2014 at 21:14

You know a completely stock version can do 220hp right off the lot with just a Hondata tune? Why Honda didn't do that, I have no idea.

AthomSfere > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 21:21

But,

The F20c in the S2000 was a 2L with 240hp, add DI to the same engine and 250+ should be no problem from Honda on a 4Cyc 2.0.

Also, the K20ZA3 (Civic Si K20) was based partly on the F20C I believe, so it sort of fits the goal.

Honda also took a shot at the inline 5 once before, and it is often regarded as their worst engine. Would I like to seem them try again and be successful, sure... But the extra cost of that engineering I would rather see them make a flat 6 or tune one of Subie's for the "GT" car. And while talking VTEC, DI and Honda... Lets just say it makes closer to 350...

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > AthomSfere
05/20/2014 at 21:44

The problem with that is that the F20 was tapped out at 240. The K has a lot more sustainable potential.

And I thought people liked the 5?

AthomSfere > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 22:20

Horribly unreliable by Honda standards.

gmctavish needs more space > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 23:00

I don't give a shit about Honda, but if this happened, I would. Total approval

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > AthomSfere
05/20/2014 at 23:03

Ahh. I thought it would be a power to mpg issue.

AthomSfere > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/20/2014 at 23:06

For the era I think it was acceptable, and the idea of a smoother power band for a luxury car made sense too... Not sure of the MPG right off, but it doesn't seem like it was horrible, just not particularly a good engine from the same Honda that was selling the Prelude, Integra, and NSX at the same time.

JACU - I've got bonifides. > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/21/2014 at 10:27

Kinja'd!!!

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > JACU - I've got bonifides.
05/21/2014 at 10:35

See? It's totally possible. I know it wasn't hugely popular then, but there is a precedent.

JACU - I've got bonifides. > BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather
05/21/2014 at 10:43

Having owned a long line of Honda products since '73, I heartily concur that a K20 based inline 5 and 6 would be killer engines. Perhaps Honda sees something like that as appearing to be a step backwards. So much of what a car maker does is based upon what it feels the public's perception will be, as opposed to what would be optimum.